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Re: My post to an economist

By: Fiz in 6TH POPE | Recommend this post (0)
Sat, 16 Jul 22 12:57 PM | 41 view(s)
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Msg. 33694 of 60008
(This msg. is a reply to 33690 by Decomposed)

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De, That's an interesting *technical* definition which is not implemented fully in any country I can think of.

Wikipedia, surprisingly, agrees! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_socialist_states

Wikipedia actually makes my point that the label "Socialist" means nothing. "Self-identification is the only criterion used by the list, therefore it includes all countries that have claimed to be socialist, even if their claims are disputed. All countries that have not claimed to be socialist are excluded, even in cases where certain outside observers regarded those countries as socialist."


And, it seems, the widespread use of a bad label (NewSpeak) is probably a strategy...like "Capitalist" and, apparently in the US, "Democracy" (where the real power is held by the Deep State, which tolerates elections only for ceremony).

What most countries practice, it seems to me, is a squishy sort of "ownership" and "control", wherein most companies continue to be privately OWNED, for purposes of title, capital formation, taxes, lawsuits, etc. but where it is implicitly understood that if a PRIVLEGED clique of "stake holders" STATE a preference, that preference is obeyed. And, of course, in EVERY country I am aware of, if the GOVERNMENT says something you had better do what the government says...or else.

Only in the United States does there remain sufficient independence in the Judiciary, and in the individual States, for there to be any serious pushback on social "requests" or Federal mandates. But, even here, it is extremely expensive ... and dangerous ... to not go along with the IMPLIED community "ownership" and government "control". So that is where the term "creeping Socialism" comes in. And, of course, "creeping" subversion is a stealth warfare technique.

Anyway, I am not aware of ANY country which really implements the TECHNICAL definition, are you? Actually, maybe that is not true...? There are many countries where SOME select businesses are nationalized -- and usually given monopoly powers as part of the deal.

By the way, I recently read that Mussolini got the concept of Fascism from an economist and the economist, in turn, got it from a putative “Communist” in Russia. It's all a slippery slide. The "Left-Right" divide doesn't seem to really exist except in the belief system of Lusers.

You've given me more to think about -- and I probably need to do a lot more scholarly reading...although that doesn't seem to help settle the issue too much. So maybe the scholars should be ignored?




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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: My post to an economist
By: Decomposed
in 6TH POPE
Sat, 16 Jul 22 4:04 AM
Msg. 33690 of 60008

Zimbler0:

Re: “Under 'Socialism' the bulk of the money falls into the 'government's hands and it's job is to 'control' EVERYTHING. ”
Getting technical, socialism is a political/economic system in which the means of production, and property, are owned by the community and controlled by government. Government is always loath to relinquish power, so when socialism fails, government moves on to communism - in which government owns EVERYTHING, including its citizens.





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