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 Msg. #  Subject Posted by    Board    Date   
47016 Re: Thoreau (cactus flower reply)
   Just in case it wasn't clear, that was a conservative argument for dem...
Cactus Flower   ALEA   13 Sep 2022
6:20 AM
47013 Queen crowd
   On the subject of a just ruler, the endless line of people silently pa...
Cactus Flower   ALEA   12 Sep 2022
10:47 PM

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Re: Thoreau (cactus flower reply)

By: Cactus Flower in ALEA
Mon, 12 Sep 22 10:08 PM
Msg. 47011 of 54809
(This msg. is a reply to 47009 by Fiz)
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Well done for your defence of Thoreau. I hated the quote, which was condescending, but you make a better tale of his worth than the quote does.

I was rather fond of our queen who saw value in everyone, and particularly those people who do their duty as small cogs in the machinery of a country. The people that Thoreau apparently despised.

The idea that it is the duty of citizens to defy tyrants has a long pedigree. I know about it, in particular, from Policraticus, the twelfth century work of John of Salisbury. The just ruler is a person who reveres the law, serves his people, defends his kingdom and honours God. The people should reject and kill a tyrant, he argues.

But unlike Thoreauu, John doesn't seek to define any individuals with that responsibility. It is a collective one. It belongs to everyone, not someone. Note this, in particular, John Wilkes Booth and his ilk.

On much the same subject, but from a different perspective, a person who writes about the injustice of mobs is William Shakespeare in Coriolanus. People who appoint themselves as bearing a higher wisdom, a wisdom which they point in the direction of rulers, are particularly prone to act foolishly and to be led around by the nose.

We had a regicide in the seventeenth century and tried a system of government without a king or queen. We restored the monarchy soon afterwards. Charles I and Charles II.

Back to today. By all means march. Some may feel so upset they will perform peaceful acts of civil disobedience to draw attention to an injustice, as they see it.

In a democracy, however, with a proper process for replacing its rulers, the big problem is taken care of. If we don't like the folks in charge, we just throw the bums out. As the US did with Trump. And we do, periodically, with our prime ministers.

Violence against a democratically-elected government by a mob of self-righteous thugs? Nope. Jail such people.