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Re: Free Download of New Edition of Designing with Libre Office 

By: Decomposed in 6TH POPE | Recommend this post (1)
Mon, 21 Nov 22 4:01 PM | 54 view(s)
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Msg. 37636 of 60008
(This msg. is a reply to 37634 by Fiz)

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fizzy:

Re: “Did you encounter major intractable bug problems or massive limitations in your Access programming work that would make everyone more-or-less abandon this path?”
I'm not sure what you're asking. Now that I have a rock-solid operating system (say what you want about Windows 10, but it is the most stable non-server Windows I've had), the database runs smoothly. No bugs. I'm tracking thousands of books, and I love many of the things Access lets me do - such as EASILY filtering for Coffee-Table Sized Books with 2 or more copies on the subject of GARDENING/BOTANY and getting a count or running a report. (Currently, I have two such books: "Step-By-Step Successful Gardening" and "Treasury of Gardening," located in boxes WV-1021 and N6-169.) But if you've been using your company database, you already know the many out-of-the-box abilities it gives the user.

I've encountered no bugs and just one major irritation: If the data contains an apostrophe, it screws up VBA which uses apostrophes in the code to denote strings. If the string being processed has an apostrophe, you get an error. In my case, since VBA processes book titles - many of which contain apostrophes - I've resorted to changing every title apostrphe ' to a backwards apostrophe `. It looks ridiculous but it solves the problem. I think it's stupid to have had to do that to the data but don't know what the "correct" solution is. I think Access should let the developer choose which character he wants to use in his code (there are so many more obscure characters that could have been used: ^, |, ~ and \, for instance, but it uses a blasted, extremely commonly entered APOSTROPHE!!!!! Dumb, dumb, dumb.) So far, I've found no way to tell Access to use a different character in its VBA code.

As for writing VBA code that integrates with Access tables being a "very much guarded secret" uh... no. I don't see it that way. In fact, I only had to read a few of the early chapters of my "VBA For Dummies" book, before hitting the internet to find the exact calls I needed to make. Then I wrote the code. I have to admit, getting the code to work as intended was hard, but only because I'd never done it before and had no good references. I think I stewed on it for 2 or 3 days! As I recall, the author of one of the books said something along the lines of not thinking that anyone on Earth knows all the calls by heart... there are just too many - thousands, maybe tens of thousands. You might think that certain calls must be extremely common and examples of how to do them should proliferate on the internet, but I didn't find any code that did what I wanted and no awesome website replete with examples. (Maybe I'd have had better luck if I weren't using a 15 year old version of Access. On the other hand, working with a program that's been around for that long can be an advantage when it comes to finding examples.) I only found things that *almost* did what I wanted. The devil was in the details - getting the VBA to do *precisely* what I wanted.

Is that what you mean in calling it a "very much guarded secret"? Nobody just sits down and cranks out functioning VBA unless they've written that exact thing before.

Getting it to work was hard. The concept itself was easy.








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Gold is $1,581/oz today. When it hits $2,000, it will be up 26.5%. Let's see how long that takes. - De 3/11/2013 - ANSWER: 7 Years, 5 Months




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The above is a reply to the following message:
Re: Free Download of New Edition of Designing with Libre Office
By: Fiz
in 6TH POPE
Mon, 21 Nov 22 2:39 PM
Msg. 37634 of 60008

Zim and De:

The list of things I "intend" to do/learn keeps getting longer (way longer) than the list of things I actually get done/learn.

That said, I continue to put "database programming", in some form, on my todo list every year. I have a lot of needs that could be met by a bunch of small databases, if the programming task didn't take too long. Sadly, this is another year when it is close to put up or shut-up time on the "learn database programming" front...and I look to be going down for another fail.

Access seems really appealing with all the form building integrated with the database design. I know it can be used to create real - and even impressive/big real - programs, because my factory uses an extensive (quite complicated and important) commercial inventory control database program written in Access. It tracks hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of ingredients and seems pretty solid, with lots of code for edge cases, and no real problems reported after years of use.

But God help you if you want to learn how to write such programs! There are all sorts of resources on "how to write Access programs" which are really nothing more complicated than desplaying and simply entering data to a couple of forms and a couple of databases. I actually signed up to take a class in that.

On the other hand, how to actually write VBA code which is integrated with your Access tables seems to be a very much guarded secret: almost harder than figuring out how to break into Fort Knox or something (and rather harder than getting into the Capitol Building, apparently).

It is MUCH easier to find "real" courses and books on writing massive database applications in Python or C# to interact with SQL databases. I don't understand why this void exists...maybe an acknowledgement that the Access model of database simplicity is somewhat unadvisable for reasons I don't understand? It seems a shame, though, because it would be tremendous to be able to snap out quick solutions to everyday organizing problems which don't require all the hardening and overhead of a full-blown relational database SERVER.

Anyway, it looks like there is never going to be a good, open-source /Linux Access-like application. If LibreOffice was going to do this, I'd think they would have already done it. And even Microsoft seems to be substantially moving away from promoting Access. Does either of you know where the problem lies in tying in an embedded language to an Access-like base? Access is certainly proof of concept; I really don't understand why this has, apparently, proved to be a dead-end instead of becoming more of a standard?

Did you encounter major intractable bug problems or massive limitations in your Access programming work that would make everyone more-or-less abandon this path?


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