Hi Zim! Thanks for replying to my question/ speculation.
Fiz > I don't know enough to totally dismiss something >like a Turkey/Muslim civilization resurgence...
Zim:
>I don't believe Islam really ever had any
>'integrity'. As I understand it, Islam still supports
>slavery - of non-believers.
It is sad how little Westerners, or at least Americans, know the history of Islam and SPECIFICALLY the history of their civilization.
The Ottoman Empire - when you consider it in its scope - was equal, if not superior, to ANYTHING which ever came out of Europe. Better than Spain; Better than France. I'd kind of rank them more in a league with the British world-wide empire. And WHERE was he Ottoman empire based?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire#Economy
P.S. I still don't know very much about the Ottoman Empire, but I NOW know enough to not make the claim you made. I have read they were quite “civilized” and treated disparate people, with other religions, remarkably well, on the whole. Arguably quite a lot better than Christians treated those non-Christians they conquered. That tends to be the case with Empires which have staying power: they treat all people who contribute to the Empire with reasonable respect.
>Islam also still has a LOT of 'religious infighting' >within itself. (Look up Shia versus Sunni >infighting.)
Yes, it does. From what I gather, some of that was encouraged by Western countries, including the US, in a "divide and conquer" strategy. Remember, the US ENCOURAGED the Shaw of Iran and, later, Saddam Hussain. The US has a near perfect record of being FINE with "slavery" and atrocities in many countries as long as their brutal dictators take their marching orders from the US and its military-industrial complex.
>By the way, Erdogan of Turkey appears to be yet >another wanna-be dictator with delusions of building >an empire - better known as 'the Caliphate'. An >empire which would eventually collide with the >Chinese empire or the Russian empire or etc. etc. >etc.
"The Ottoman Empire,[k] historically and colloquially the Turkish Empire,[25] was an empire[l] that controlled much of Southeast Europe, Western Asia, and Northern Africa between the 14th and early 20th centuries."
Again, I suggest you read up (actually both of us read up more) on Ottoman and even earlier MAJOR civilizations based out of the people and even the religion we now call Islam. Persia IS Iraq. Even the first known monotheistic religion, which unmistakably provided the template for the Jewish and Christian religions was Persian Zorastrianism. You will be amazed at the extent of the influence/borrowings. But the Persians were the original chosen people, I think is probably fair to say.
>Correct me if I'm wrong . . . But I believe the >United States Constitution is the only document which >truly enshrines 'Peoples Rights' with 'Rule of Law'.
>
>Zim.
I agree with you there.
P.S. I've made a lot of bold statements in this response pulled from memory, which may be flawed. I'm not taking the usual time to fact check or provide more filler. Correct me on any of my assertions with a reference and you will be doing me a favor.
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